Hurt Meets Healer Podcast
Hurt people, hurt people. Are you ready to work through the pain of your past? Healing is possible! Join us on our healing journey, a journey to freedom, where you'll get straight truth from genuine people.
We use our story and experience to help others walk through the trauma of intimate betrayal. This is raw and real talk from average people who are walking the path of healing.
Kim is a Certified Professional Mentor™ through BraveHearts University, and a Certified Christian Life Coach through the Board of Christian Life Coaching.
Hurt Meets Healer Podcast
Should I Stay or Should I Go? Part 1
Making the difficult decision to leave a relationship is one of life's most challenging crossroads, especially when betrayal, chronic disrespect, or ongoing harmful behaviors are involved.
• Seven key indicators that it might be time to consider leaving: persistent harm/abuse, unrepentant behavior without accountability, fundamental incompatibility, stagnation/loss of self, one-sided effort, violation of non-negotiable boundaries, and enabling harm
• Forgiveness doesn't equal reconciliation - they are separate choices that deserve individual consideration
• Before leaving, ensure you've exhausted all reasonable efforts through communication, counseling, and seeking wisdom
• In dangerous situations, prioritize safety above all else and plan carefully with professional guidance
• The biblical perspective offers balance: while God values relationships, Scripture acknowledges situations where distance becomes necessary
• Leaving is necessary when a relationship consistently undermines your safety, dignity or ability to live out your purpose
• The next episode will specifically address when leaving a marriage after sexual betrayal might be necessary
If you're struggling with these difficult decisions, we'd love to connect with you and provide support. Reach out to us at www.hurtmeetshealer.com.
Thank you for listening! For more information about us and the services we offer, visit www.hurtmeetshealer.com.
Intro & Outro music written, performed, and produced by Kim Capps.
This podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be considered legal, medical, or professional advice. The views expressed by the Host or any Guest(s) are strictly their own and in no way constitute legal, medical, or professional advice.
Copyright ©️ 2025, Hurt Meets Healer, LLC. All rights reserved.
Kim Capps ministry that was created to help individuals and couples who are walking through the devastating impact of sexual addiction and infidelity. Thanks for joining me today. Hey y'all, welcome back. Welcome back as we embark on a new episode here. Last time we were discussing the third part of the Million Dollar Three Letter Word, which is ask, and we talked, concluded. All of that with. It becomes a problem, and relationships thrive really on mutual understanding, and when there is lack of mutual understanding, that's when this chasm hits and we kind of go our separate ways, which brings us right to this episode that we are discussing today, which is should I stay or should I go? It's a two-part series that we're going to go on. Hey, john, welcome. Oops, dadgum boy, I mute, you know, I wish I had that button in real life.
Speaker 2:Right Howdy.
Speaker 1:Howdy Thanks for letting me join.
Speaker 1:Sure I would say interested I'm not going to go with excited, but I'm interested in what you have to say about all this tonight. So should I stay or should I go? That is the question on the table tonight that when sexual betrayal hits, it's tough. It is just a big old bucket of suck and it can get to the point when healing doesn't occur, when accountability isn't happening, when the lying and deception continues.
Speaker 1:I know from my side of the street I asked this question so many times through the years, years, and I would come back to my commitment and the vow that I made in my marriage and truthfully, I fought with God on this a lot. I would pace back and forth over in my she-shack and just wrestle with God on this and scream at Him and ask Him to let me go, Release me from this. The pain it was more the pain of being lied to, having the person who committed to love me, to honor me, to cherish me, have the ability to look me dead in the eye and just lie, and my heart couldn't take it.
Speaker 2:And.
Speaker 1:I was begging for God to let me just let me file for divorce and I tell you what I've I don't hear God speak audibly very often, in that in those times when I was doing that, I heard a resounding no and I didn't understand why at the time. I may see something coming around now that some recovery is happening, better, better recovery is happening. So deciding to leave a relationship is happening. So deciding to leave a relationship and we're going to talk about different relationships, from marital to family to friends that is an individual's choice. It's a deeply personal choice. In certain situations, it may be necessary to do that for your well-being, for your safety and your growth, and so we're going to look at several insights and principles and maybe some key indicators of when leaving a relationship might be necessary. What do you say on this, john? Are you ready to dive in?
Speaker 2:It's an incredibly difficult topic and I'll just say I'm not sure how much I have to contribute on the topic, simply because it is so, so difficult and I realize how much pain's tied to it on your side. So you know I have some. I do have some thoughts, and they've morphed over time as I've, I think, or at least attempted to grow in grace and humility. But it is a I recognize that it's an excruciatingly painful topic to even address, to even have to think about. Do I leave a relationship? And so I will offer a few thoughts along the way. But I just want you to know it's not from a perspective of anything other than just the recognition of the amount of pain that's tied to this kind of conversation.
Speaker 1:Sure, well, and next episode is when we're going to dive into when leaving a marriage due to sexual betrayal may be necessary.
Speaker 1:It'll be the next episode. So y'all stay tuned. So y'all stay tuned. Today we're talking about they are marriages, but we're not specifically talking specifically about sexual betrayal today. Necessarily, all of these things align with what I would coach any of my clients to do in the betrayal situation and I myself have been in. I have been. Excuse me, y'all, I will not edit that out. So welcome to my world of allergies.
Speaker 1:Down here in Texas, I've been blindsided by friends and family and my character maligned it was a character assassination and wrongly accused and I ended up having to pull back from several relationships due to being unsafe with them. One is a close family member. Well, several were close family members. They still are family members, we're just not that close anymore and some friends and it was a hard decision. I had a lot of counseling on that and I even pushed back on my counselor when he said you need to take a 90-day sabbatical from these people. They are not doing you well.
Speaker 1:So let's dive into these key indicators that leaving a relationship may be necessary. There are seven that we're going to go over tonight, and the first is if there's persistent harm or abuse, and that includes physical, emotional, verbal. If a relationship involves ongoing abuse, any kind of violence. Manipulation and ongoing is my word If it is repeatable offenses that occur, not a one-off that, oh, my wife got triggered one time and kicked me, or something. That's not ongoing abuse. That is trauma-related, is it right? No, however, I'm not here to make those judgment calls on that. So if there's ongoing abuse, which is manipulation, gaslighting, belittling violence, leaving is often necessary to protect your safety and mental health. And what I really like, that the Bible actually speaks to some of this. If we can take out our religiosity, if you will, that's my word and just really look at what King David was saying in Psalm 11, 5, when he says the Lord examines the righteous, but the wicked, those who love violence, he hates with a passion. Now, I was taught that hate is a bad word.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:And yet there it is. Because God detests. He detests those people that love violence. He prioritizes peace and he tells us in Romans 12, do not take revenge, leave room for God's wrath, for it is written it is mine to avenge, I will repay, says the Lord. And oh, my goodness, how hard it is when you're hurt, when someone slights you, and I know for myself, I want to strike back. It is really a strong act of my will, self-control, discipline, that I've learned over these years to not do that and to realize this person's broken. That person has some issues that I cannot help them with, I can't fix Right, and so I have to go pull myself out of the situation, which I did a lot with us.
Speaker 2:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1:And what were your thoughts when I would do that?
Speaker 2:What were your thoughts when I would do that? It was sobering to recognize the amount of pain and effort that it took to break that relationship, because that's really what's happening is, you know, there's a, there's a fracture in the relationship and that's what causes, um, the you know, the drawing away or the pulling away, that chasm that you talked about earlier, earlier, and it it's just, it's that it's kind of a gut punch to sit back and go. Oh man, this isn't good. I could lose this person that I love.
Speaker 1:Right, but the repeated lying, the repeated deceit and the repeated betrayal didn't stop. It was Right and the repeated betrayal didn't stop.
Speaker 2:It was Right, and it goes back to your statement earlier, that you're dealing with a very broken person and healing takes time and it is. You know. There's a whole lot of things.
Speaker 2:I'm trying to get healthier healthier and it is taking time, and it takes a long time to move that needle, to get the pain to stop, and and it's just such a familiar experience on the pain side, the physical pain side of trying to get healthy, that it it shows it to me better on the emotional and spiritual side of trying to get healthy, that it shows it to me better on the emotional and spiritual side of healing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the chronic disrespect and deceit and betrayal. And one of my I don't know if it's a boundary, but if the other party refuses to change, I don't know if it's a boundary, but if the other party refuses to change, refuses to address it, or I say, refuses to change despite efforts to address it, to allow everyone's emotions to settle and calm down, there are good, great people out there coaches, counselors who can help with that. So, if you feel safe, these are some signs. If you feel unsafe, not safe. If you feel unsafe, these are some signs. If you feel unsafe, not safe. If you feel unsafe, if you are being diminished constantly, if you're feeling really anxious around this person, it might be the time to consider taking a break.
Speaker 1:At Grouse Giller, we were on a break. Oh, I shouldn't bring that up. That's not a thing, all right. So number two is unrepentant harm with no accountability. If someone repeated again this is repeat the words repeatedly, chronic, ongoing these are major words here, where we're defining what this is If it's repeated hurt on a one-time thing, that someone you know haphazardly being a dork just hurt your feelings or something.
Speaker 1:That's not what we're talking about here. We're talking about repeated harm and hurts and they show no remorse or willingness to change. In other words, they ignore your boundaries, they just walk all over them, they dismiss your feelings, they minimize your feelings, they minimize the hurt and pain, they minimize the event in your experience. Then that relationship just might be unsustainable. And we're advised man I kind of push back on Matthew 18. It's been so overused, you know. Oh, go to Matthew 18. That just kind of oof rubs me the wrong way, but it advises about confronting sin and the person doing the harm. And if they won't make it right, if they won't turn and fix I don't like the word fix either but make amends, start to repair, then it's my opinion, it's necessary to distance then it's, in my opinion, it's necessary to distance.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and there's a phrase or a word that I'll use a number of times as we have this discussion over the next couple of episodes, and that is unrepentant. Repentance is a turning, and so we have to remember in all of this that the person that has this behavioral pattern that they are working to change and what you're saying, what I'm hearing you say, is you're keying on the ones that aren't really interested in even recognizing the pattern or doing any effort to change. Those are the folks that you're really talking about.
Speaker 1:Well, and also the false recoveries, the false, the fakers.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:I've lived in that world as well, that's the big piece of.
Speaker 2:One of the telltale signs, at least in my understanding, is if somebody's not really interested in changing and that first begins with recognizing that oh man, I've got a problem, then it's going to be real difficult to work with them, to forgive them and yeah, you've got that experience.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and the sign is when you've communicated your concerns very clearly. I have a rule to communicate with me. There are three ways you can communicate with me verbally. There are three ways you can communicate with me verbally so you can tell me. And then I request that you sum up what you say, either in an email or a text, or heck, the best would be all three. Let's verbalize it. Oh, but even better we could add a fourth Record it, Send it that way and then it's for sure you know you've communicated. And that's what I have done. I have verbally done this. I've sent emails, I've sent text message clearly communicating my concerns and how I've been hurt.
Speaker 1:But if the other person refuses to take responsibility or make amends, boy, that's a big sign that you might want to consider a separation from this person. And, like I said, it's not a permanent thing, because God is always working in people. So it may be a season that you go through, it may be a long season, but it's a season that you go through of separation and that's okay. We spent many, many, many days, weeks, months separated.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:And that was healthy for me, because I could not live with A person who was just so untrustworthy that every time I looked and I'll just be honest every time I looked at you and heard anything coming out of your mouth, to me it was immediately a lie, right yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that makes sense.
Speaker 1:So you want to do three and four.
Speaker 2:Fundamental incompatibility, so misaligned values or goals. If core beliefs, life goals or priorities which would include faith and family and career are irreconcilable and cause ongoing conflict, the relationship may hinder both parties' growth. For example, 2 Corinthians 6.14 warns against being unequally yoked with unbelievers in close partnerships. And those are the things that communication begins to break down and help us align. Oftentimes in relationships we get our sides drawn up and I'm not willing to yield or even have the conversation to gain understanding about why you think or believe a certain way, block our horns on it and we don't even really know what we're, what we're fighting about anymore, because we've never even had the conversation.
Speaker 2:We've had a few of those breakthroughs right behind these very microphones yeah and and it's, and so I would encourage you if you're, if you're seeing that and some of those um things know, lack of mutual respect show up in those conversations or lack of conversations. But if respect and support and reciprocity is absent, the relationship may not be serving either person. And one of the signs of all that is you just feel unable to be your authentic self or pursue your purpose without constant compromise. And so the you know, communication, communication, communication. It's kind of like the law of real estate.
Speaker 1:Well, you can communicate all day long, but communication is a two-way street. I can inform you of my needs and my desires and my wants, and they get shut down.
Speaker 2:Right, because communication is the act of both of us attempting to gain understanding of each other's perspective.
Speaker 1:Right and when the other person doesn't do that.
Speaker 2:Right, it makes it difficult. And so number four would be stagnation or loss of self. So if the relationship stifles your personal growth, identity or mental health, you've lost confidence, joy or independence. It might be time to leave or pause or take a separation. Scripture encourages stewarding your life well first, corinthians 6, 19 and 20. Your body is a temple, and so one of the signs of that, or some of the signs of that, might be that you begin to feel trapped or drained or disconnected from who you are and you just don't feel safe to show up as your authentic self. Or, over time, you can even lose who your authentic self really is, who your authentic self really is.
Speaker 1:Boy, I have been down that road as well. I was so trying to be who everybody else wanted me to be. Man I should have separated from a lot of people a lot of times a long time ago. Holy moly, all right, moving right along. So number five is a one-sided effort. Relationships holy balls, did I just curse on the anyway. Relationships require, it requires both people Mutual effort. Even if you're the hurting one, it still requires effort on your part. And if you are consistently the hurting one, it still requires effort on your part, and if you are consistently the only one investing, in other words. I'll give you an example In our relationship, I think I have been the one to initiate most of the conversations over this and I probably have a good what's that word? Evidence to prove that. However, we're not proving anything here. It's been a one-sided. It has felt to me very one-sided a lot of the time in our recovery time in our recovery, and I have a term that's called closing the loop, resolving conflicts. Wow, we do not do that well.
Speaker 1:No, you know, we did that last week, though a couple of different times, Yep we sure did Yep, and that's what leads when you don't resolve conflicts, which we did for over 30 years.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Over 30 years. Oh my gosh, we had like a boatload of freaking conflicts. The loop wasn't closed.
Speaker 1:Right Closed the loop, You'll never get to talk about the big ones, because every time you attempt to talk about the big ones there's 100,000 small ones in the way that you trip all over trying to get to anything and hours and hours later you still haven't even gotten to the main topic that you're trying to discuss, right, yeah, and that leads to flipping resentment and I know I can remember so many times feeling just exhausted, weary is a good word and you know the Bible totally speaks to that on mutual support and relationships.
Speaker 1:It's in Ecclesiastes I recommend you look it up chapter four. So a sign is and this is number five one-sided effort when the other person is disengaged, indifferent or unwilling to work on the relationship. And I would even say, if it is a false desire to work on the relationship where they, I will say I believe that you thought that if we worked on the relationship, that would fix everything. Worked on the relationship, that would fix everything. And that's not the case Because, individual, we, individually, especially you, you were unwilling to dig into the hurts that were blocking.
Speaker 1:Am I on path here? I don't want to be like accusatory or anything, but that's just. Those are the facts yeah, it was.
Speaker 2:It was hard for me to wrap my head around, um, and I still struggle with the whole. You know, let's go back to your childhood, which is and I think part of that's growing up in the era that I grew up in, you know. But at the same time time as I've begun to be willing to do that and look at some of those incredibly deep wounds and expose them and talk about them and work through them with good help, they've begun to heal and, as a result, I've begun to heal and become more healthy and more able to be in the conversation and close the loop.
Speaker 1:But would you I say, but let's just take that word on out Would you say that at one point or at some point in this you were unwilling? Well, I say unwilling because I really still think you believe that if we worked on the relationship, that would fix everything? Yes or if I would get my Chautauqua together, that would fix everything.
Speaker 2:I had a really strong belief that if we could just get our relationship right, everything else would fix itself. Everything else would fix itself. And the other thing is I also had a very strong bias, that you know. I don't need to be digging into cupboards that are closed you know, digging up the past.
Speaker 1:Digging up bones.
Speaker 2:Right, exactly. I mean I had a core belief that that was a fool's errand and only leads to pain. And you know, it certainly exposed a lot of pain, but I also recognized that exposing it was the key to begin to healing it and and so I still struggle with that bias. I mean I have to overcome that bias. Every time my counselor goes back into something or we start bringing something up, I have to really override that bias because there's this huge part of me that still fights against that and says this is nonsense, this is in the past, it's not hurting me, we're going to have to talk about that.
Speaker 2:Well, no, I'm saying, that's something that I recognize.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's what you were saying. Yeah, okay.
Speaker 2:That's a piece of me that I've really had to overcome that whole mindset, and so you know, one of the things that I've heard a lot in recovery is that you know it only takes one to blow up a relationship, but it takes two to fix it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, for sure.
Speaker 2:And that's the one-sided effort thing. It does take two.
Speaker 1:Takes two to tango, all right. Number six Violation of non-negotiable boundaries. So I had no idea what boundaries were many years ago. I thought, hey, boundary means I can control another person. That's not it at all. It is what I will accept in my life and what I choose to be a part of or not be a part of. And so if your core boundaries are again repeatedly violated, I get somebody, people, accidentally I say accidentally, I think it is an accident, it's not on purpose Violate a boundary once. Okay, that's not what we're talking about. We're talking about repeated violations.
Speaker 1:So I have a boundary now, a healthy boundary around honesty and around safety and around fidelity. And if those are repeatedly, well I would say fidelity. If that's violated even once now, that will be a deal killer for me. I'm looking at you there, senior, and so honesty, safety, but again repeatedly violated and the attempts to hold your boundaries. If you tell someone, hey, stop hurting me, stop lying to me please, I say stop. That's like you're trying to control, but you're just asking. You're asking for what you need and you put a healthy boundary out there saying, look, I am not going to be in relationship with someone who's not honest, I'm not going to be around someone who's not faithful to me and I'm not going to be in relationship with someone who is unsafe for me and holding to those. If someone repeatedly violates your boundaries, leaving might be necessary to honor yourself and your values, and Proverbs 4 speaks to a lot about guarding your heart. And so the sign is you've set clear boundaries, but they're repeatedly ignored or disrespected.
Speaker 1:And so that leaves us to number seven, when staying enables harm. And I will just say right now I was an enabler of my own of the harm that was done. I enabled a lot of things. I made excuses for you, john, I made all the, everything that I could do wrong. Pretty much I did rather other than saying here, she's pretty, go talk to her.
Speaker 1:So staying in a relationship can sometimes enable destructive behavior, addictions, irresponsible living in yourself or even in the other person. And so tough love I'm sure you've heard that term before tough love may require distancing to encourage change or to protect all involved, and that may be a child who is on drugs and they can't hold a job down and they want to come live in your house. It might be a parent who's an alcoholic that comes around. It might be you name it a friend, a husband? When staying in a relationship enables harm, it's time to consider taking a break and possibly leaving, and the sign is that your presence perpetuates unhealthy cycles without any kind of progress or improvement in it without any kind of progress or improvement in it.
Speaker 1:So a few things to consider before putting the gauntlet down and leaving and again I want to stress, taking breaks a season. You don't have to write people out of your life. God still works in humans as long as they have breath in them. I believe there's still hope in a human being. They just don't have to be around me while there's hope going on in their life.
Speaker 2:I just hope they're not around me that's right.
Speaker 1:So four considerations before making that big step. Is you've exhausted all efforts. So, if safe and feasible, try to address the issues through open communication. And I get especially ladies who are listening, who are the betrayed spouses. It's hard to talk to an addict. I get that it's hard to have communication and a lot of times we have to keep our thoughts and feelings close and to ourselves in order to protect ourselves. But if you've attempted, if you've made attempts to communicate, if you've done the counseling route, you've gone through mediation, therapy, coaching and nothing has worked, then that may be one of the check marks that says, hey, I've exhausted everything, you've exhausted all efforts, you've sought wisdom, you've prayed and you've reflected. You've consulted wise counselors, as Proverbs really talks about. You've forgiven, and forgiveness doesn't mean or doesn't equal reconciliation. I remember the first time I said that to you. The look on your face was like what Do you remember that I do? Do you have anything you want to add?
Speaker 2:Well, that's a difficult topic, it's just a hard.
Speaker 1:there's so much in that whole topic. We have that topic coming up Multiple episode worthy.
Speaker 2:I did a 28-session study on forgiveness because it was an area that I really had some issues to work through, so it's hard to drop a one-liner in there that really does justice to the pain on the side of the person forgiving and to the topic itself.
Speaker 1:All right, thank you. Yeah, so forgiveness doesn't always mean staying. Sometimes it means, because I love you, I'm going to have to let you go, you, I'm going to have to let you go and I'm going to choose to leave and separate myself from this unhealthy relationship. So you've exhausted all efforts, you've sought wisdom and now you assess safety and man in abusive situations, prioritize safety, plan your exit carefully. I highly recommend, with a professional, some kind of violence coordinator, counselor, somebody who knows what they're doing, and keep that very tight-knit, especially in abusive situations. That's what I'm talking about abusive where your life could be at stake. And then the grieving heel stage, because leaving it's not number one, an easy choice to make, and then it's not an easy action to take, and so when it happens, it's best to allow yourself to grieve that loss. Find a great counselor, find a community that will surround you, that will love you through the difficult time that you're going through. And so the balance here is as we are Bible believers, we're Jesus followers, and so we really ascribe to what God's Word says about these things.
Speaker 1:God values relationships. He created us for relationship, but he also acknowledges the need to distance ourselves in some cases. In Matthew 10, the passage of shaking the dust off your feet. When, rejected, jesus was telling his disciples you know, if they don't welcome you in, shake the dust off your feet and move on. So leaving doesn't negate forgiveness. That is a must. Forgiveness is an act of love for yourself that opens your heart to healing. Now, when is it not necessary? Well, now, that was one that you could jump on right there.
Speaker 2:Huh, Right, yeah that you could jump on right there. Huh, right, yeah. Well, let me back up and add one more point on the biblical balance piece of this, and that is there's that section in, I believe, 2 Corinthians where Paul talks about putting the guy out of the church, turning him over to Satan.
Speaker 2:Well later on in the chapter, he encourages the church to then reach out to that same guy because he demonstrated repentance. And so you know, there's both sides to that that we have to remember Right, both sides to that that we have to remember right. And and when is it not necessary if? If these issues are resolvable through mutual effort, communication and growth? So I mean the. The reality is both parties are, are being honed in this, in this process. I mean, iron sharpens iron. Sometimes it breaks it first, but but iron sharpens iron. And so don't rush to leave, don't allow yourself to be abused. But at the same time, you know that, mat, that Matthew 18 passage that you were referencing talks about, you know, bringing more and more people into the loop.
Speaker 1:Ooh, be cautious, be cautious, ladies, about that.
Speaker 2:If I mean that is the charge, there it is.
Speaker 1:However, be cautious.
Speaker 2:Sure, absolutely. They have to be trustworthy, they have to be right. I'm not saying just pick up the phone.
Speaker 1:They're not coming with pickaxes, right, exactly. That's not what that's about.
Speaker 2:Right, it's about resolution.
Speaker 1:Love.
Speaker 2:Yes. So patience and grace are the virtues that we're really keying on here. And it's hard, it's hard, it is. I can barely speak to that, but I know, watching, how hard it can be and I know by experience how hard I made it.
Speaker 1:And I will second that. All in favor, all right. So one final note, guys, is leaving is necessary when the relationship consistently undermines your safety, your dignity or your ability to live out your purpose. So I want to encourage you to trust your instincts. Seek guidance there are so many wise people in this world Seek wisdom and understanding and prioritize peace. If the situation involves complex factors kiddos, abuse get professional support. That's most likely the best path is getting professional help.
Speaker 1:It's a hard decision and next time we will be discussing on the topic part two of this of deciding whether to leave a marriage after sexual betrayal, which could be straight-up affairs, infidelity, porn, all forms of sexual unfaithfulness, deciding when to do that, because that's a hard decision. That's a painful and complex decision, especially for anyone who's been married for any length of time. It's the two shall become one flesh and it just makes a hard, hard decision to make. So that will happen next time on our next episode should I stay or should I go? Part two and we'll talk about when leaving a marriage that is, uh, had sexual betrayal in it might be necessary. Any final words, john.
Speaker 2:No, I'm not 100% looking forward to that particular episode, honestly, but I'm glad that we're able to talk about it and I'm thankful for those of you that are listening. We'd love to connect with you. We'd love to connect with you. Reach out to us and just tell us what you're gaining or hearing from the podcast.
Speaker 1:we'd love your feedback if it's kind, I have delicate emotions. Y'all thanks for joining us. We appreciate time and we do not take it lightly. We value that and just know that you are loved. You're awesome and you're worthy of honor and respect and love. God bless y'all. Thank you for taking the time to listen today. Remember you are more than what happened to you. We'd be honored to come alongside and guide you on your healing journey. Connect with us at wwwhurtmeetshealercom. Until next time, God bless.
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